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Steriods: Worth the Risks??
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Default Steriods: Worth the Risks?? - 09-26-2011, 01:03 PM

I have competed a natural bodybuilder for a long time and have had many people tell me to "cross over" and compete with drug enhancement. Who knows-maybe I would be a IFBB pro now OR another guy out there trying to make it big and spending alot of money on chemicals.
I AM NOT AGAINST ANYONE DOING STERIODS-TO EACH HIS OWN.
I personally have chosen to compete naturally for alot of reasons but would like to share and discuss some reasons why I haven't.
  • Health concerns
  • Hair loss and gyno
  • Feel like no honor in it
  • You would have to get on tons of stuff to be competitive at the top level

I take a look at all these guys at the gym who I know are taking it and despite their hardwork all I see and say to myself is "You are only at that level because of chemicals."
I know it is hard work too and not chemicals alone but that is what I think. As as matter of fact alot of people think that. Don't want to be "that guy."

As a topic of the week wanted to see what everyone thought in regards to this subject!


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Default 09-26-2011, 01:51 PM

i agree to each his own.me personally i did it about 16years ago and it did exactly what it said it would.made me strong as hell in a short period of time unfortunatly it had it consequences with getting strong to fast and ripping my shoulder to bits.would i do them again i dont know but as of right now im good to go without.


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Default 09-26-2011, 01:51 PM

We are on nearly the same page Tim. Except I could give a rats ass about hair anymore...it's over-rated!

I look at people I know that are on and often think the same thing as you...yet I have no real qualms with it. I have witnessed some half-assers though that have respectable size/strength and know they are on, but if they were as dedicated as I am, I know they would look better. Or that said, I wonder where I'd be if I were to get "on" myself.

I have toyed with the idea, but I'm a minimalist. I just want to keep progressing and I honestly think with my natural test levels on a natural decline, that progression is pretty much not going to happen in most areas of my lifting. I don't want any part of HGH and if I ever did anything illegal, I'd like it to just be test alone with a once a week stick. Nothing more. But many reasons stop me. My kids are one major reason and for the mere fact that both like working out and I feel like I'm deceiving them if I do it and don't tell them. Then if I do tell them, they are going to think it's okay and I don't want either one touching it til they are over 25 yrs old.

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Default Not only that - 09-26-2011, 02:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
We are on nearly the same page Tim. Except I could give a rats ass about hair anymore...it's over-rated!

I look at people I know that are on and often think the same thing as you...yet I have no real qualms with it. I have witnessed some half-assers though that have respectable size/strength and know they are on, but if they were as dedicated as I am, I know they would look better. Or that said, I wonder where I'd be if I were to get "on" myself.

I have toyed with the idea, but I'm a minimalist. I just want to keep progressing and I honestly think with my natural test levels on a natural decline, that progression is pretty much not going to happen in most areas of my lifting. I don't want any part of HGH and if I ever did anything illegal, I'd like it to just be test alone with a once a week stick. Nothing more. But many reasons stop me. My kids are one major reason and for the mere fact that both like working out and I feel like I'm deceiving them if I do it and don't tell them. Then if I do tell them, they are going to think it's okay and I don't want either one touching it til they are over 25 yrs old.

Did I ramble enough?
We tell our kids not to break the law and to be honest. Ok, "crossing over to the roid side (play on android Lol) 1. alot of it is illeagle 2. I just know, when I was younger I didn't need it for powerlifting. I was satisfied with the progress I was making. 3. A big powerlifter in Texas said he'd kick my butt if I did. Even if he's 67 years old. 4. I couldn't say "I" did this. it would be me and roids did this.
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Default 09-26-2011, 03:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimM View Post
I personally have chosen to compete naturally for alot of reasons but would like to share and discuss some reasons why I haven't.
  • Health concerns
  • Hair loss and gyno
  • Feel like no honor in it
  • You would have to get on tons of stuff to be competitive at the top level

I take a look at all these guys at the gym who I know are taking it and despite their hardwork all I see and say to myself is "You are only at that level because of chemicals."
I know it is hard work too and not chemicals alone but that is what I think. As as matter of fact alot of people think that. Don't want to be "that guy."
Honestly, never ran "real" gear, but if they're anything like PH's I'll say this. It beats the hell out of your body. I mean bigger stronger...ya that's great but it kicks your ass mentally and physically, things 90% of the guys who gear up don't talk about and 100% of the people who've never tried it don't know about. Lifting natural is hard as hell, don't get me wrong, but mentally being 'on' is way harder imo not just because of the physical taxation it takes on you, but the discipline to stay on course and not over-train or give up.

I don't want to make small the health concerns, as they are very real and yes very dangerous. It would be stupid to think otherwise. But I see guys racing motorcross, drag racing, rock climbing, hell even hunting (guns and lime disease) yet "health considerations" are never really talked about in those sports. I think it's the old adage, people fear what they can't see. External risks (broken bones, potential of death from falling) are somewhat seen as not as threatening as organ failure. Granted I'm way more afraid of organ failure than drowning while kayaking, I'm just saying people sometimes put greater worry on different things for their own reasons.

Gyno sucks, but with todays medicine it's fixable IF you are very careful in what you're taking and how much, and aren't afraid of being upfront with your DR in the first place, and there are credible doctors who have said that. Ask Romano at rxmuscle, he's had the surgery to fix it. Balding...well some of us will have to face that one day anyway, I know I will so it's kinda moot point for me.

Top level stuff...those guys get sponsors, donations, and don't forget the $$ they win isn't exactly peanuts. So it's not a money issue. If you're talking about the bodily risk...well, if you're the current MR O how much money did you just make in the last week between the Olympia and the Sheru classic?

As for the no honor thing, to each his own. Some people think gearing up is easy, I don't believe so. Yes it will make you bigger, but it brings obstacles of it's own that just stack up on the already demanding BB'ing lifestyle. Most people think racing in NASCAR is easy, but those people have never raced anything a day in their life either.


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Default 09-26-2011, 03:53 PM

I think with educated and prepared use that AAS is far more safe than ph use. Ph's(and supplements in general) are pumped out at a ridiculous pace now days, once one get banned...BOOM they throw some new shit out there with no real knowledge(to a degree) or testing done. Ive lost faith in phs long ago and it has become a way for companies to just make quick cash and possibly risk their customers health along the way.

All while basic AAS compounds have been around, unchanged, used, and studied for 40-60 years.

Honor is a different story. Going to a comp that you know others are geared and competing is ok. Going to a natty comp and competing is pathetic.

I myself am not on. I have tried twice with my only luck being that it whatever plain oil was in the bottle didn't give me an infection. But only day I'll get a good dr to hook me up, then it's on like donkeykong64
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Default 09-26-2011, 04:04 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by onetiredkris View Post
I think with educated and prepared use that AAS is far more safe than ph use.

Honor is a different story. Going to a comp that you know others are geared and competing is ok. Going to a natty comp and competing is pathetic.
Ditto.


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Default 09-27-2011, 09:42 AM

Good responses. Really good.
I think that if you train hard and eat and rest the way you are supposed to you will make great gains and keep growing huge.

I tell you what annoys me. I see alot of people that are on that won't admit it. I had this one training partner for a year who was getting strong and stronger and bigger and bigger and passing me up on some big lifts. I knew something was fishy. One day after a whole year he confessed to me he was using and had been for a while. That was some bullcrap because I was wondering how he was getting so strong so fast.

Personally, I think alot of the pro's and top level national competitors are on more stuff than you could ever imagine. I think tons of them are on Synthol. A medication for this, and another medication for that.
I'm good. I will pass on all that stuff. The stuff that is tempting is the cutting agents. Because it gets so hard to get cut as you get older. However, they come with crazy side effects. Like Clen actually destroys heart cells. If a person was to compete with that stuff they would have to know and accept that they will only be able to go so far unless they were willing to go all out!


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Default 09-27-2011, 10:15 AM

so where does the line end.. Steroids are nothing more than supplements. Beit very strong supplements.. But supplements all the same.

If you think different, just look at the definition..

". Something added to complete a thing, make up for a deficiency, or extend or strengthen the whole."

or even wiki for bodybuilding supplement - "Bodybuilding supplements may be used to replace meals, enhance weight gain, promote weight loss or improve athletic performance"

You speak of honor.. and natural.. Do you take creatine? When cutting, do you take any type of thermogenic?

So I ask is it cheating or dishonorable to take any form of supplement?? Where do you draw that line? Legality?? Most prohormones are derivatives of the real hormone and or covert to testosterone in the body.. so while there are a few left that the FDA in their infinite wisdom haven't as yet had banned.. Are these too in fact cheating??

I can see the point being made for a person that used steroids and concealed that to enter a Natural contest.. Yes, thats wrong. But again.. where do you draw the line or distinction of what is truely natural and what is not..

health concerns.. Hmmm.. There is an inherent risk in anything we take. Tylenol.. you name it, there is a risk. The difference I believe would be more of use vs. abuse.
Steroids can be very benficial and are very much safe if properly used and properly dosed. It when you abuse them, you start getting into health issure and things like hairloss.
More and more studies are done each month proving the benefits of steroids.. So like I mentioned.. It's more a case of use vs abuse.

But a great topic none the less
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Default 09-27-2011, 10:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by basskiller View Post
so where does the line end.. Steroids are nothing more than supplements. Beit very strong supplements.. But supplements all the same.

If you think different, just look at the definition..

". Something added to complete a thing, make up for a deficiency, or extend or strengthen the whole."

or even wiki for bodybuilding supplement - "Bodybuilding supplements may be used to replace meals, enhance weight gain, promote weight loss or improve athletic performance"

You speak of honor.. and natural.. Do you take creatine? When cutting, do you take any type of thermogenic?

So I ask is it cheating or dishonorable to take any form of supplement?? Where do you draw that line? Legality?? Most prohormones are derivatives of the real hormone and or covert to testosterone in the body.. so while there are a few left that the FDA in their infinite wisdom haven't as yet had banned.. Are these too in fact cheating??

I can see the point being made for a person that used steroids and concealed that to enter a Natural contest.. Yes, thats wrong. But again.. where do you draw the line or distinction of what is truely natural and what is not..

health concerns.. Hmmm.. There is an inherent risk in anything we take. Tylenol.. you name it, there is a risk. The difference I believe would be more of use vs. abuse.
Steroids can be very benficial and are very much safe if properly used and properly dosed. It when you abuse them, you start getting into health issure and things like hairloss.
More and more studies are done each month proving the benefits of steroids.. So like I mentioned.. It's more a case of use vs abuse.

But a great topic none the less
Good points. Yes a good topic.
Cheating is a different story.
Additionally I would to say it is soo very nice to say "I am not on steriods" to people who ask "How did you get so big and strong."
But YES that is a good question?
What is legitamately "all natural?"


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Default then and now - 09-27-2011, 07:13 PM

I copied this from and article from MD.. from the early days to modern cycles...who's got the money for this

References:

1. Janofsky M. Doctor Says He Supplied Steroids to Medalists. The New York Times, 1989 June 20.

2. Cohen J, Collins R, et al. A league of their own: demographics, motivations and patterns of use of 1,955 male adult non-medical anabolic steroid users in the United States. J Int Soc Sports Nutr, 2007 Oct 11;4:12.

A comparison of cycles across time:
*The presentation of these cycles is for informational purposes only and does not condone the uses described below.

Early adaptor cycle— c. 1958

Four to eight week cycles of 5-20mg Dianabol daily

The classic cycle— c. 1960s-1970s

Duration: 8-12 weeks + taper

Week 1: Testosterone cypionate 200mg, 20mg Dianabol daily

Week 2: Testosterone cypionate 200mg, 30mg Dianabol daily

Week 3: Testosterone cypionate 200mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 30mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 4-6: Testosterone cypionate 300mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 30mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 7-10: Testosterone cypionate 400mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 40mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 11-12: Testosterone cypionate 200mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 30mg Dianabol daily

Week 13: Testosterone cypionate 200mg, 30mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 14-16: Taper on Dianabol only

*Note: During the ’60s-’90s, pyramiding was common as post-cycle recovery was dependent upon tapering. Also, the lack of effective aromatase inhibitors and sensitivity to estrogenic side-effects caused some to use lower doses of testosterone and substitute Anavar for the Dianabol, though with lesser mass and strength benefits. Pre-contest cycles would substitute Primobolan for the testosterone in ever-increasing ratio. Rumors of higher doses are likely invalid as water retention and gynecomastia would have been evident.

Andreas Munzer’s ‘Death Cycle’ (as reported in Der Spiegel)— c. 1996

Weeks 1-10: Ephedrine, Aspirin, Clenbuterol, Valium, Captagon, Cytomel




Weeks 1-5:
Testosterone Enanthate 500mg daily,
Parabolan 152mg daily,
Dianabol 150mg daily,
Halotestin 150mg, daily
HGH 20IU daily,
Insulin 20IU daily



Weeks 6-8:
Masteron 300mg daily,
Parabolan 152mg daily,
Winstrol Tab 250mg daily,
Halotestin 150mg daily,
Winstrol Inj. 50mg daily,
HGH 24IU daily



Weeks 9-10:
Masteron 200mg daily,
Winstrol Inj 100mg daily,
Halotestin 200mg daily,
Winstrol Tab 400mg daily,
HGH 24IU Daily,
Insulin
IGF-1 Aldactone and Lasix for 3 days before show

Note: some have disputed this list as being inaccurate, whereas others state it is consistent with Munzer’s use. No toxicology report was available for confirmation of the drugs’ presence.

Current cycle— c. 2008

MASS-GAINING CYCLE:

Weeks 1-6**

1. 250mg testosterone enanthate every other day

2. 200mg Deca every other day

3. Growth Hormone (GH) 3IUs per day, every morning upon waking

3a. Insulin (Humulin-R) 8IU with breakfast/4IU 5-6 hours later

4. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara, every other day

Weeks 7-12**

1. 250mg testosterone cypionate every other day

2. 200mg EQ every other day

3. Growth Hormone (GH) 3IUs per day

3a. Insulin (Humulin-R) 8IU with breakfast/4IU 5-6 hours later

4. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara, every other day

Weeks 13-18**

1. 250mg Sustanon-250 or Test Cypionate (or Enanthate), every other day

2. 75mg trenbolone, every other day

3. Continue GH, 3IU per morning

4. Insulin (Humulin-R), 8IU with breakfast, 4IU 5-6 hours later

5. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara every other day

PRE-CONTEST DRUG CYCLES:

MINI-CYCLE:

1. 250mg testosterone cypionate every other day

2. Equipoise (Boldenone) 200mg every other day

3. Clenbuterol: 20mcg 2x per day

4. Cytomel: 25mcg per day.

5. GH, 3IU taken every morning before breakfast

6. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara, every other day

START AT 8 WEEKS OUT:

1. 250mg Sustanon (or Test Cypionate or enanthate) every other day

2. Trenbolone 75mg, every other day. Take every day for last 7 days.

3. Winstrol, 50mg every other day. Take every day for last 7 days.

4. Continue Clenbuterol, GH, and Cytomel

5. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5 mg Femara every other day, every day the last 4 weeks

Note: There are numerous examples of bodybuilders using MUCH higher doses. This protocol is one that is consistent with many of the top-tier bodybuilders, averaging between 1,000-2,000mg androgen exposure/week. Of course, some report taking up to 5,000mg androgen/week, along with adjunct drugs. Several of the top bodybuilders still include oral anabolic steroids in their cycles at extremely high doses (e.g. oral Winstrol tabs in excess of 100mg/day). IGF-1 is still used by some, whereas the more exotic research chemicals (e.g. myostatin inhibitors, interleukin-15) or designer drugs are rarely mentioned. Further, most pros stay on year-round, though they may have low-dose ‘vacations’ of 150-200mg testosterone/week as there is insufficient time for full recovery of the hypothalamic-pituitary-gonadal axis.

Recent competitor cycle, very high dose (unconfirmed)— c. 1996-2000

Weeks 1-17: 750mg testosterone cypionate/enanthate weekly


Weeks 1-14: 100mg testosterone propionate every other day

Weeks 15-20: 100mg testosterone suspension daily


Weeks 1-20: 50mg of Deca-Durabolin daily


Weeks 1-20: 150mg Parabolin every other day


Weeks 1-20: 50mg trenbolone acetate daily


Weeks 1-20: 100mg equipoise daily


Weeks 1-20: 8 Andriol gelcaps daily
(Not specified): 8 Clenbuterol— 2 days on, 2 off


Weeks 1-20: 150mg Winstrol-V daily
Weeks 1-20: 40mgs of Nolvadex ED


Weeks 1-14: 4 IU Growth Hormone (Humatrope) 5 days on 2 off


Weeks 15-20: 6 IU Humatrope— 5 days on, 2 off

Weeks 1-20: Insulin (Humalin N and Humalin R), dose not specified
(Not Specified): Cytadren, dose not specified


Weeks 1-20: Cytomel 75-150mcg daily


Weeks 1-20: Halotestin 40mg daily


Weeks 14-20: Masteron 50mg daily

Note: This cycle obviously was in use prior to the advent of effective aromatase inhibitors, as they have replaced the need for Cytadren and dependence on 5α-reduced anabolic steroids (e.g., Masteron). This is an extremely dangerous cycle due to the frequency and volume of injections, inclusion of Halotestin and use of insulin. It is present only for illustration of the drug use trends.


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Default 09-27-2011, 07:29 PM

Why do I get the feeling that behind every top pro is a mysterious mad scientist dressed in black nobody ever sees lol.

Tell ya what though, these guys are living a lot longer than we'd think, amazing what the body can do. And in all honesty, that list scares the crap out of me. But if I thought I had a shot to be the best, I'd do it.


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Default 09-27-2011, 07:31 PM

Insane, even their 'classic cycle' is WAY out there. 16 weeks of dbol?? I can't imagine the sides people were getting back then
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Default 09-27-2011, 07:33 PM

I remember reading someware that Bruce lee was a major steroid user and experimented with long duration-multiple compound cycles. Imagine the shit storm the media would have if that ever got proved correct?
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Default 09-27-2011, 07:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by onetiredkris View Post
Insane, even their 'classic cycle' is WAY out there. 16 weeks of dbol?? I can't imagine the sides people were getting back then
This is what you have to do to compete at that level....who wants to have to worry about it.

1. Having a steady supply cause the people you get it from may not be able to get it anymore.
2. with anything it takes time if you haven't built a solid base...guess what when you stop good bye to the gains you added to a weak base.
3. Talk about addictions I knew guys that couldn't come off...and if they did they were so paranoid that they would look small and would resort to wearing 2-3 sweaters to continue to look big....true story.
4.I've seen some nasty infections from the black market stuff....wow nasty.
5. Some guys don't have health issues....some do who wants to play that lottery game.

And last think about this their have only been 16 Mr. Olympias since 1965 till present...those are sh*ty odds if you looking that far into doing this.

Genetics are a big factor in this also a HUUUUUGE Factor.


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Default 09-27-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by onetiredkris View Post
I remember reading someware that Bruce lee was a major steroid user and experimented with long duration-multiple compound cycles. Imagine the shit storm the media would have if that ever got proved correct?
aw man.......you just totally popped my child-hood bubble of Bruce Lee being THE MAN!!!! I'm going to need therapy now! No I won't....he's still THE MAN!


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Default 09-28-2011, 03:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigmix View Post
I copied this from and article from MD.. from the early days to modern cycles...who's got the money for this

References:

1. Janofsky M. Doctor Says He Supplied Steroids to Medalists. The New York Times, 1989 June 20.

2. Cohen J, Collins R, et al. A league of their own: demographics, motivations and patterns of use of 1,955 male adult non-medical anabolic steroid users in the United States. J Int Soc Sports Nutr, 2007 Oct 11;4:12.

A comparison of cycles across time:
*The presentation of these cycles is for informational purposes only and does not condone the uses described below.

Early adaptor cycle— c. 1958

Four to eight week cycles of 5-20mg Dianabol daily

The classic cycle— c. 1960s-1970s

Duration: 8-12 weeks + taper

Week 1: Testosterone cypionate 200mg, 20mg Dianabol daily

Week 2: Testosterone cypionate 200mg, 30mg Dianabol daily

Week 3: Testosterone cypionate 200mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 30mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 4-6: Testosterone cypionate 300mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 30mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 7-10: Testosterone cypionate 400mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 40mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 11-12: Testosterone cypionate 200mg X 2 (Mon, Fri), 30mg Dianabol daily

Week 13: Testosterone cypionate 200mg, 30mg Dianabol daily

Weeks 14-16: Taper on Dianabol only

*Note: During the ’60s-’90s, pyramiding was common as post-cycle recovery was dependent upon tapering. Also, the lack of effective aromatase inhibitors and sensitivity to estrogenic side-effects caused some to use lower doses of testosterone and substitute Anavar for the Dianabol, though with lesser mass and strength benefits. Pre-contest cycles would substitute Primobolan for the testosterone in ever-increasing ratio. Rumors of higher doses are likely invalid as water retention and gynecomastia would have been evident.

Andreas Munzer’s ‘Death Cycle’ (as reported in Der Spiegel)— c. 1996

Weeks 1-10: Ephedrine, Aspirin, Clenbuterol, Valium, Captagon, Cytomel




Weeks 1-5:
Testosterone Enanthate 500mg daily,
Parabolan 152mg daily,
Dianabol 150mg daily,
Halotestin 150mg, daily
HGH 20IU daily,
Insulin 20IU daily



Weeks 6-8:
Masteron 300mg daily,
Parabolan 152mg daily,
Winstrol Tab 250mg daily,
Halotestin 150mg daily,
Winstrol Inj. 50mg daily,
HGH 24IU daily



Weeks 9-10:
Masteron 200mg daily,
Winstrol Inj 100mg daily,
Halotestin 200mg daily,
Winstrol Tab 400mg daily,
HGH 24IU Daily,
Insulin
IGF-1 Aldactone and Lasix for 3 days before show

Note: some have disputed this list as being inaccurate, whereas others state it is consistent with Munzer’s use. No toxicology report was available for confirmation of the drugs’ presence.

Current cycle— c. 2008

MASS-GAINING CYCLE:

Weeks 1-6**

1. 250mg testosterone enanthate every other day

2. 200mg Deca every other day

3. Growth Hormone (GH) 3IUs per day, every morning upon waking

3a. Insulin (Humulin-R) 8IU with breakfast/4IU 5-6 hours later

4. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara, every other day

Weeks 7-12**

1. 250mg testosterone cypionate every other day

2. 200mg EQ every other day

3. Growth Hormone (GH) 3IUs per day

3a. Insulin (Humulin-R) 8IU with breakfast/4IU 5-6 hours later

4. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara, every other day

Weeks 13-18**

1. 250mg Sustanon-250 or Test Cypionate (or Enanthate), every other day

2. 75mg trenbolone, every other day

3. Continue GH, 3IU per morning

4. Insulin (Humulin-R), 8IU with breakfast, 4IU 5-6 hours later

5. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara every other day

PRE-CONTEST DRUG CYCLES:

MINI-CYCLE:

1. 250mg testosterone cypionate every other day

2. Equipoise (Boldenone) 200mg every other day

3. Clenbuterol: 20mcg 2x per day

4. Cytomel: 25mcg per day.

5. GH, 3IU taken every morning before breakfast

6. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5mg Femara, every other day

START AT 8 WEEKS OUT:

1. 250mg Sustanon (or Test Cypionate or enanthate) every other day

2. Trenbolone 75mg, every other day. Take every day for last 7 days.

3. Winstrol, 50mg every other day. Take every day for last 7 days.

4. Continue Clenbuterol, GH, and Cytomel

5. 1mg Arimidex or 2.5 mg Femara every other day, every day the last 4 weeks

Note: There are numerous examples of bodybuilders using MUCH higher doses. This protocol is one that is consistent with many of the top-tier bodybuilders, averaging between 1,000-2,000mg androgen exposure/week. Of course, some report taking up to 5,000mg androgen/week, along with adjunct drugs. Several of the top bodybuilders still include oral anabolic steroids in their cycles at extremely high doses (e.g. oral Winstrol tabs in excess of 100mg/day). IGF-1 is still used by some, whereas the more exotic research chemicals (e.g. myostatin inhibitors, interleukin-15) or designer drugs are rarely mentioned. Further, most pros stay on year-round, though they may have low-dose ‘vacations’ of 150-200mg testosterone/week as there is insufficient time for full recovery of the hypothalamic-pituitary-gonadal axis.

Recent competitor cycle, very high dose (unconfirmed)— c. 1996-2000

Weeks 1-17: 750mg testosterone cypionate/enanthate weekly


Weeks 1-14: 100mg testosterone propionate every other day

Weeks 15-20: 100mg testosterone suspension daily


Weeks 1-20: 50mg of Deca-Durabolin daily


Weeks 1-20: 150mg Parabolin every other day


Weeks 1-20: 50mg trenbolone acetate daily


Weeks 1-20: 100mg equipoise daily


Weeks 1-20: 8 Andriol gelcaps daily
(Not specified): 8 Clenbuterol— 2 days on, 2 off


Weeks 1-20: 150mg Winstrol-V daily
Weeks 1-20: 40mgs of Nolvadex ED


Weeks 1-14: 4 IU Growth Hormone (Humatrope) 5 days on 2 off


Weeks 15-20: 6 IU Humatrope— 5 days on, 2 off

Weeks 1-20: Insulin (Humalin N and Humalin R), dose not specified
(Not Specified): Cytadren, dose not specified


Weeks 1-20: Cytomel 75-150mcg daily


Weeks 1-20: Halotestin 40mg daily


Weeks 14-20: Masteron 50mg daily

Note: This cycle obviously was in use prior to the advent of effective aromatase inhibitors, as they have replaced the need for Cytadren and dependence on 5α-reduced anabolic steroids (e.g., Masteron). This is an extremely dangerous cycle due to the frequency and volume of injections, inclusion of Halotestin and use of insulin. It is present only for illustration of the drug use trends.
Dude - good post!!!!!!!


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Default 09-28-2011, 03:37 PM

You have to take tons of crap just to compete in the nationals or junior nationals.
I go to alot of local shows. These guys are taking insulin, GH, and tons of stuff - just on a local level. I have been seeing distended guts on athletes at non-qualifying shows.
Craziness.
@BIG
Plus you forgot all the Synthol.


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Default 09-28-2011, 04:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimM View Post
You have to take tons of crap just to compete in the nationals or junior nationals.
I go to alot of local shows. These guys are taking insulin, GH, and tons of stuff - just on a local level. I have been seeing distended guts on athletes at non-qualifying shows.
Craziness.
@BIG
Plus you forgot all the Synthol.
yes I did struggle at the thought when I was younger it's just what you did back in the late 80's and 90's.

Now will their be anything to rival steroids....science right now is pushing out some serious stuff. The supp and diet industry is a billion dollar industry enough to push the boundaries of supplement company's to find the next great legal enhancer!


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Default 09-28-2011, 06:02 PM

You know why I can't knock guys loading up on steroids and why I don't praise guys taking OTC supps instead. OTC supps are pure and simple just trying to do what steroids do. People wanna get big, some are willing to break the law and boot up, some want to stay legal and swallow 100 pills instead.

I'll tell ya what tho, theres guys taking tons of stuff that look like crap compared to guys that run simple hdrol cycles or something.

Really though, the consumers/fans are really what drive the industry. As "natural" shows gain steam, even the juiced side of the game will start going away from the mass monster to the classic look. Sure guys will be big, but the more people start saying, WTF, the more it's gonna change. With social media being so big, it's easy for the guys at the top (the weiders/mag editors, promoters, NOT the athletes) to keep their finger on the pulse of BB. Money talks, the sport will ultimately go where the people want it to go. With Phil up top, we're already seeing that sure we want big guys, but we want them to look "right". That's why guys like Vic and Kai will never win an O, hgh guy = death sentence, people are only willing to take so much.


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