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Did You Say Chest Training ???
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Default Did You Say Chest Training ??? - 10-10-2013, 10:23 AM

Had a good friend this morning contact me about training. It got me to thinking about all the guys out there trying to build a big chest. Here are my thoughts. First off. Yeah bench press is what everyone things builds a big chest but honestly it is not. Bench Press is a major compound movement where the pecs are only used in conjunction with other parts of the upper body. It is not the best exercise to build a superior upper chest. If you are lacking upper chest quality then you need to be doing inclines, and I'm talking about barbell inclines. Dumbells are fine but Barbell Inclines offer the best bang for your buck when it comes to training the upper chest. What I mean by good development on the upper chest is this: If you can stand to the side and do a side chest pose and your upper chest becomes a shelf and you can sit something on it without it falling off then your upper chest is coming along good. If not then you need to be doing Inclines.

Also when I say Inclines there are some points here that really need to be discussed. I see guys in the gym all the time and it drives me batty the way they do them. Barbell rules to follow are pretty simple. Go all the way down to the chest touch your chest right above the nipple and push back up. This half rep I see where people go down half way then push back up is bullshit. This is doing nothing but working the triceps and being supported by the traps. This is not an incline press. You have to get the full movement in. All the way down and all the way back up and squeeze. This will make the chest contract and push blood into the areas you want worked. However, there is a cheat method you can use with inclines barbell or dumbbell that can be used every so often mostly at the end of sets or as an extra pump set. Bring the weight down to the chest then press back up halfway then come back down again pumping the weight from the bottom this will create an awesome pump in the chest and really get those fibers to working hard. So in my opinion Barbell Inclines are the best for upper chest development It will also help increase strength in the Bench Press as well because your upper chest will be stronger from it.

Now to talk about what everyone likes to do besides Bench Press and what most people do wrong when doing them. The Dumbbell Incline Press. Everyone loves doing them but few do them right. First off, Most people go way to heavy for what they can really do. I see egomaniacs in the gym all the time getting the 100's throw them up do half inch presses then throw the dumbbell to the floor thinking they did something. Look fella the only thing you just did was piss off the gym owner for possibly destroying an expensive piece of gym equipment and making yourself look like an idiot because you really can't control the weight. Rule of thumb if you can't control the weight up and down you don't need to be trying to handle it unless you have spotters who can catch the weight when you are done. Also another big thing with incline DB's is the fact I hardly ever see people going down far enough. Like with the Incline Barbell , Dumbbells need to come down all the way and even a little further to give you a better stretch in the bottom portion of the movement. This is where Dumbbells are great at the bottom part for the stretch then at the top portion of the movement for the squeeze. But, I only see a small percentage of guys doing this. It is mostly just moving the weight not feeling the weight. Feeling the weight is what will get you your results. Just moving it to move it really is wasted effort, and that is one of my cardinal sins in the weight room. Wasted effort.

I will talk only a little bit about Decline Bench because I'm not a huge fan of it. Mainly because there are other exercise, secondary exercises that can build the lower pecs better and because regular bench press you are getting lower pec stimulation. I see alot of guys doing heavy Declines and I love this because they thing they are doing something when in actually here again your wasting your time. The decline is a shorter range of motion and more weight can be used but at the same time it is not stimulating lower pec development when you have other secondary movements that can be used to get the same thing with better results. Other secondary like pull overs or leaning dips . But this is my opinion.

Like the Incline Barbell, Dumbbells do have a cheat method that can be done correctly and utilized to pump more blood into the pecs but again this should only be done sparingly either at the end of an exercise or every once in awhile. NOT EVERY SINGLE WORKOUT. Search out the big Bench Press guys in your gym and I'm not talking about the guys who do just Bench Press The ones who can do the 500lb bench presses are the ones doing these other exercises as well. Here is a good example of a well rounded chest workout

Bench Press 4 to 5 sets
Incline Barbell Press 4 to 5 sets
Dumbbell flys or Cable Flys 4 to 5 sets.

You can't go wrong with that because that is a possible 15 sets for chest if you want 20 sets add in one more secondary but if you are using enough intensity and not just moving weight to move weight you will destroy your chest each week you perform this.


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Default 10-10-2013, 11:31 AM

Great post Mac, I have been pondering some chest workout questions to post...and now you make this awesome chest workout post. You answered my question before I asked it, that's cool


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Default 10-10-2013, 12:59 PM

Ill be putting up each week an article about each bodypart.


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Default 10-10-2013, 05:07 PM

Weighted dips are a staple of my workouts. Nothing nails my chest like them. I used to do a lot of incline work, but since switching to a strength based program, I'm really just hitting the basics.

I can't help but think, I'm missing out not doing incline fly's though. - They were brilliant... I may be 'inclined' to bring them back. (Pun intended.)

The biggest white elephant in my opinion, is the cable fly. They're absolutely useless. I've never felt them do a thing. Some may disagree, but... I dunno, they're pretty bad.

Has anyone ever done push ups between benches, with a loaded weight belt? If not, I recommend it. Strongly recommend it.
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Default 10-11-2013, 08:59 AM

The cable fly is good at the end of workout or chest session for a good stretch and squeeze. Good at pushing blood into the area worked. I would not depend on it for a main movement at all. Plus half the people doing cable flys do them wrong. Almost all cable movements have to be done slow and methodical to really emphasize working the muscle.


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Default 10-11-2013, 09:37 AM

great post MAC. for me what i noticed is if i do like 4 sets of flys to get the blood in my chest then go into heavy BB incline press ill get a better contraction. i have been doing this type of chest workout for about a month now and i really like it. Im still decently strong but i never 1rm so i dont really know if im weeker doing flys first. I used to think flys are a finisher but lately i have been doing them first movement and last movement with great results. I BB and have seen many pros do pre-exhaust sets so i thought id give it a try. Just sayin its worth a try


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Default 10-11-2013, 09:48 AM

Oh yeah I don't think there is anything wrong with pre exhausting. I usually do several machines first for several sets to warm up and stretch. When you reach upper more advanced levels I think you have to do some extra stuff to get the stimulation you need. Plus I want to be totally warmed up when I get started on the heavy stuff. I think some people don't realize what properly warmed up is. I think it is where you got that light sweat and can feel the muscle really warmed up. Then I think it is at it's prime time to really work hard.

cra- made a good comment a moment ago about doing push ups in between sets. I think that is good as well. We do this when we do our cable stuff and other secondary movements just to add some extra sets and work it extra hard.

Training chest is not rocket science like the rest of the body but If most people would keep with the basics they can never go wrong. I think what some people do is over think how training should be or just use Bro Science ( which I detest sounds like some Jersey shore crap ) .


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Default 10-11-2013, 04:46 PM

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Originally Posted by RoaringMad Mac View Post
Training chest is not rocket science like the rest of the body but If most people would keep with the basics they can never go wrong. I think what some people do is over think how training should be or just use Bro Science ( which I detest sounds like some Jersey shore crap ) .
I like that bro science statement alot. I have people try to tell me things every day, yet they walk around with toothpick arms and beer bellies! I would take advice from any one of you here before any joker that I had a second thought about. I honestly wish I could hire Mac to train me full time for a few months. Think it would take me a long way


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Default 10-12-2013, 05:57 PM

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Plus half the people doing cable flys do them wrong.
Just half? Hahaha!!! I can't remember the last time I've seen a cable fly performed correctly. Maybe the scene in Pumping Iron just before Arnie shows Ken Waller his back pose? - In fact, that could be the only time!

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toothpick arms and beer bellies!
You've just described my physique in five words.

(I maintain it like that on purpose... It makes my squat and deadlift look heavier.)
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Default 10-12-2013, 06:19 PM

Excellent post and a few things I may need to work into my routines.


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Default 10-15-2013, 03:29 PM

Here's where I disagree. (and I know Mac is talking about people doing straight up half assed stuff but I really want this to be clear)

The whole "touch the bar to your chest bro" is absolutely nothing more than a pissing contest for gym dudes.

It's rooted in power lifting where every lift has a starting and finishing position. If bodybuilding or general health are your aim, and extended hold at the bottom or lockout at the top is something to avoid. You'll only wind up pulling, tearing, and crushing your joints and connective tissue.

Depth and height of any press depends on grip width and an individuals capable range of motion. Some guys can hit their chest, some guys can't, their body might not be flexible enough, shoulders may not be lined up right. Just as genetics affects muscle shape from person to person, flexibility can be affected as well.

Touching your chest with a close grip becomes entirely an arm workout. Touching your chest with a wide grip becomes a delt workout and at the bottom all the weight is hanging on your biceps which are one of the smaller muscles of your body...not meant for holding heavy loads.

Range of motion will vary style to style and person to person. So long as a person is using their chest to do the work, range of motion means little.

For me, my chest was at its best doing half reps with the barbell and full reps with dumbells. Wound up fuller, stronger, and with far less injuries. 6 months of the touch my chest with the barbell mentality just cuz everyone says to do it that way landed me a pretty bad shoulder injury.


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Default 10-15-2013, 03:29 PM

Here's where I disagree. (and I know Mac is talking about people doing straight up half assed stuff but I really want this to be clear)

The whole "touch the bar to your chest bro" is absolutely nothing more than a pissing contest for gym dudes.

It's rooted in power lifting where every lift has a starting and finishing position. If bodybuilding or general health are your aim, and extended hold at the bottom or lockout at the top is something to avoid. You'll only wind up pulling, tearing, and crushing your joints and connective tissue.

Depth and height of any press depends on grip width and an individuals capable range of motion. Some guys can hit their chest, some guys can't, their body might not be flexible enough, shoulders may not be lined up right. Just as genetics affects muscle shape from person to person, flexibility can be affected as well.

Touching your chest with a close grip becomes entirely an arm workout. Touching your chest with a wide grip becomes a delt workout and at the bottom all the weight is hanging on your biceps which are one of the smaller muscles of your body...not meant for holding heavy loads.

Range of motion will vary style to style and person to person. So long as a person is using their chest to do the work, range of motion means little.

For me, my chest was at its best doing half reps with the barbell and full reps with dumbells. Wound up fuller, stronger, and with far less injuries. 6 months of the touch my chest with the barbell mentality just cuz everyone says to do it that way landed me a pretty bad shoulder injury.


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Default 10-16-2013, 10:22 AM

The fact that beginners can't differentiate between what half reps can do they see guys in the gym doing them and learn from that. Instead of doing full range motions first and then learning later on when Half reps can and do work.

Yep there are people that can get away with doing half reps. One of my best friends and a huge bodybuilder. You all have heard me talk about him for years Robert Rothrock did half reps on just about everything. BUT...... He knew how to "FEEL" the weight being pushed.

Case in point saw two young men doing inclines last night and they where over loading the bar for their size and only coming down a quarter of the way. Now I usually don't say anything but I could not help myself since they where young.

Oujia, I respect you for saying that and agree that range of motion varies from style to style. and what I focused on in this article was the fact for most beginner trainees. Only when they have come a certain way and when they know what Intensity and the feel is , in my opinion they need to stick to basic fundamental movements. You can't go wrong with these.

It is like going in and telling someone they can get a big chest by doing just cable flys. ( belive me I've seen people who think this.)

Almost all successful bodybuilders have the basic fundamentals down and have a base in Powerlifting.

Bench Press like I said is a compound movement working different muscle groups in the same exercise. Inclines depending on grip position yes does work different areas of the muscle but a good shoulder width grip down to the chest will or actually I should say just above the nipple should hit the outer chest and inner chest on the upward position, and I should add in that squeezing at the top will work the inner chest.

I am certainly not the guru of guru's in chest training but having these basic things down is what I am focusing on. Once at an advanced level all sort of things can be done to hit all parts of the chest. Your going to get and extra tricep delts and shoulder workout from Inclines anyway just because your holding the weight up and these muscles are going to work to finish the movement.

Also where I think people go wrong with half reps is they don't do them controlled even cheat reps are not really cheat reps if done right. This can cause more injury more so than extended hold at bottom or lockout as you have said. In most cases it is sloppy form and not controlled and this is where injuries happen.

You said full reps with dumb bells, this is an extra stretch in the outer pec, controlled that is fine. sloppy form and not with control can and will lead to problems .

All things must be under control at all times. You know this but beginners not so much and they look at some other Jabroni in the gym and learn the wrong way.


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Default 10-16-2013, 10:23 AM

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I like that bro science statement alot. I have people try to tell me things every day, yet they walk around with toothpick arms and beer bellies! I would take advice from any one of you here before any joker that I had a second thought about. I honestly wish I could hire Mac to train me full time for a few months. Think it would take me a long way


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Default 10-16-2013, 10:25 AM

Ouji,

Im not disagreeing with you as much as I'm just pointing out proper form for beginners. Your dead on what you said and I thank you for that.


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Default 10-16-2013, 02:56 PM

And I agree with you as well. I just don't want someone new to lifting who experiences pain closer than an inch or two from the chest or just plain can't move that far, thinking if they force the issue they'll be doing something right when in reality they're just injuring themselves over what they heard to be the "right way".


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Default 10-16-2013, 03:26 PM

It's almost like those universal home fitness machines they sell, my roomate has one and the press is sooooo uncomfortable for me I refuse to use it, I stick to the adjustable bench. Most of them are good, but this one has no adjustments for height so it is where it is and that's it.


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