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Who should have won???
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Default Who should have won??? - 05-22-2012, 08:28 AM

I recently judged an OCB natural bodybuilding show. I was told via email and in person to make sure to award conditioning over size. This actually pissed me off. The promoter said because genetics aren't limited and we can at least control our diet.

Couple things here.....Ready?

First....
Aren't people genetically more lean than others and can get shredded easier?
Second...
So now good genetics are a bad thing?
Thirdly....
Layne Norton was there. Super nice guy. I told him I voted for the black guy because he was shredded and had at least 60 pounds of more muscle on him. He said he was very close on conditioning from the front but was as conditioned from the back.

SO LET ME GET THIS STRAIGHT!!!
So slightly more conditioned from the back is greater than 60 pounds of muscle that is already very shredded meritting an overall title???

In the NPC he would have won the title easily!!!

Anyone, anyone, anyone, can diet to the point where they are losing muscle and come in shredded, but the guy who had a good offseason and came in shredded and kept his muscle and came in huge is the true winner!!

I am very very aggrevated with these natural shows. I have lost to guys alot smaller than me because of conditioning issues. Seriously, it is a bodybuilding show.

I have actaully decided from that I will be doing NPC shows only!

So...watch the video and you decide!


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3E9UiZ77NU[/ame]


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Last edited by TimM; 05-22-2012 at 08:37 AM.
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Default 05-22-2012, 08:40 AM

Tough call imo. Black guy has more size and looked better up top, but legs need tightening up. And I wanted to see his rear double bicep pose...but didn't see him do it. White guy has a pretty good upper back on the rear double bicep pose. Over all they both look good. I'd lean more towards the black guy...but fairly close imho.


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Default 05-22-2012, 09:59 AM

I agree with Rick on this. But Natural shows are a funny beast to begin with. I've never really seen any really big guy win a natural show. Conditioning is everything to them. It does seem that size is penalized in natural shows.


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Default 05-22-2012, 11:40 AM

The one thing I noticed the smaller guy from the bigger guy was the smaller guy was more cut, looked like he had dieted harder than the big guy. Just my observation.
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Default 05-22-2012, 02:25 PM

OCB - Black trunks win
NPC - Purple trunks win

I think i know purple trunks, is he from the Orlando, Altamonte area?


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Default 07-06-2012, 04:02 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by emekajokammor View Post
OCB - Black trunks win
NPC - Purple trunks win

I think i know purple trunks, is he from the Orlando, Altamonte area?
I love the diplomacy with trunk color rather than skin color.

I don't want to notice their crotch area that much so I'll just say the black guy was way better.

Kidding aside...The guy is much taller and should be much bigger. The wee little guy looked like he belonged doing crossfit not bodybuilding. So ya, the bigger guy should have won cuz even going by proportion...the white guy was lacking...and forgot to bring his lats with him.

I'm with Tim. Actually, Tim shoulda been on the stage n smoked em both...but hey wut do i kno


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Default 07-06-2012, 04:25 PM

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Originally Posted by RoaringMad Mac View Post
I agree with Rick on this. But Natural shows are a funny beast to begin with. I've never really seen any really big guy win a natural show. Conditioning is everything to them. It does seem that size is penalized in natural shows.
Depends on the natural show I think. In all honesty, I tend to believe "natural" is a catch word to advertise the show and make it more "legit" or appealing, rather than a requirement. Just talking to guys who have done natural shows over the last 20+ years...there ain't a whole lot of natural and there's a whole lot of suspicion. I've talked to guys who have competed with some "all natural" guys that have been on various mag covers...and they spilled the beans on these guys who will seemingly take their claims to the grave.

Seems like the "true" natural thing is just taking off now. Honestly though, as much respect as I have for any competitor, it's like race cars. Sure a 10 second car is fast. But we all really wanna see those 4 second cars do their thing.


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Default 07-09-2012, 08:55 AM

I know in the competition I just finished they were serious about "natural", we did polygraph, and the first 3 places had to take a pee test. So I'm all about the NWARKANSAS NATURAL bodybuilding competition. It gives me an honest chance.
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Default 07-09-2012, 12:39 PM

never understood why gear up guys would want to compete against natties.


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Default 07-09-2012, 03:01 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by emekajokammor View Post
never understood why gear up guys would want to compete against natties.
cuz their training sucks lol


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Default 07-09-2012, 03:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by emekajokammor View Post
never understood why gear up guys would want to compete against natties.

I've asked myself the same thing.


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Default 07-10-2012, 12:37 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by emekajokammor View Post
OCB - Black trunks win
NPC - Purple trunks win

I think i know purple trunks, is he from the Orlando, Altamonte area?
Yeah that is where the show was.

You nailed it on the head!!!!
Black trunks win in OCB.
Purple trunks would have smoked him in the NPC.

Natural shows are nothing but a diet contest!!

Plus he is shorter. Shorter dudes should ALWAYS have bigger legs that taller guys.

I still cant believe that he lost.

I will stink with the NPC.
NPC does treat their competitors like crap. But at least they reward size!


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Default 07-10-2012, 07:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimM View Post
Yeah that is where the show was.

You nailed it on the head!!!!
Black trunks win in OCB.
Purple trunks would have smoked him in the NPC.

Natural shows are nothing but a diet contest!!
Plus he is shorter. Shorter dudes should ALWAYS have bigger legs that taller guys.

I still cant believe that he lost.

I will stink with the NPC.
NPC does treat their competitors like crap. But at least they reward size!
Natural shows are nothing but a diet contest!!

that's what I was told back stage at an OCB contest! Conditioning man conditioning....I've seen guys that looked like long distant runners more than they did Bodybuilders!

That's not to take anything away from what they do but this is bodybuilding hard work building up muscle in the off season and finding a balance between holding on to what you built and trying to come in as lean as possible not skinny as possible!


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Default 07-11-2012, 08:50 AM

Ha! You guys are spot on. I admire their dedication. My friends are currently in a 22 week diet, one is a natural pro and the other is an OCB athlete and they are truly dedicated.


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Default 07-11-2012, 09:30 AM

Yep


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigmix View Post
Natural shows are nothing but a diet contest!!

that's what I was told back stage at an OCB contest! Conditioning man conditioning....I've seen guys that looked like long distant runners more than they did Bodybuilders!

That's not to take anything away from what they do but this is bodybuilding hard work building up muscle in the off season and finding a balance between holding on to what you built and trying to come in as lean as possible not skinny as possible!


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Default 07-11-2012, 09:33 AM

This is one of the problems for Matt IMO. He comes in shredded but during the off season he can get so damn strong and then have to diet it out so much. I know it has to be frustrating. We are working our asses off now to put as much muscle on him and Daniel right now.
They will be doing two different type of shows but none the less training is hard core for sure. That is my problem with natural shows I'm impressed with the dedication but I sometimes wonder if all that dedication is worth 3 steps forward 2 steps back analogy.


Your thoughts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emekajokammor View Post
Ha! You guys are spot on. I admire their dedication. My friends are currently in a 22 week diet, one is a natural pro and the other is an OCB athlete and they are truly dedicated.


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Default 07-11-2012, 11:39 AM

IMHO, the naturals that diet down have real control on their diet. I know I had slip here and there and came in less than what I wanted to look like. I can't blame it on anyone or anything, it was just lack of commitment on my part and it showed. I'll be on que this next time. I want to show em I may be old but I'm not gone yet!
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Default 07-11-2012, 01:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PAPAW View Post
IMHO, the naturals that diet down have real control on their diet. I know I had slip here and there and came in less than what I wanted to look like. I can't blame it on anyone or anything, it was just lack of commitment on my part and it showed. I'll be on que this next time. I want to show em I may be old but I'm not gone yet!
Go get'em Paw! I see you rocking the new avi too!! I like i like


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Default 07-11-2012, 03:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoaringMad Mac View Post
This is one of the problems for Matt IMO. He comes in shredded but during the off season he can get so damn strong and then have to diet it out so much. I know it has to be frustrating. We are working our asses off now to put as much muscle on him and Daniel right now.
They will be doing two different type of shows but none the less training is hard core for sure. That is my problem with natural shows I'm impressed with the dedication but I sometimes wonder if all that dedication is worth 3 steps forward 2 steps back analogy.


Your thoughts.
Honestly Mac...it's not worth it imo on a yearly basis. Maybe if you can take a year or two off between shows to put the size one, but to compete yearly...no way.

Somewhere I read it takes 8 years to genetically max out naturally, under ideal conditions (not necessarily realistic). I'm sure the bulk/cut cycles make this lonnnnnger.

The icons of the sport past and present were all geared up for a reason. But, so long as gear is illegal, it's impossible to regulate the use. But imagine a world where everyone at a certain level was given the same exact cycle(s). That would be neat.


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Default 07-11-2012, 03:15 PM

Oh yeah that would be..... but then again if it was legal and therefore regulated. There are those that would go over the top and still try to get that edge.

Kinda like regulator plates in NASCAR.... LOL The way I look at it anyway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ouija View Post
Honestly Mac...it's not worth it imo on a yearly basis. Maybe if you can take a year or two off between shows to put the size one, but to compete yearly...no way.

Somewhere I read it takes 8 years to genetically max out naturally, under ideal conditions (not necessarily realistic). I'm sure the bulk/cut cycles make this lonnnnnger.

The icons of the sport past and present were all geared up for a reason. But, so long as gear is illegal, it's impossible to regulate the use. But imagine a world where everyone at a certain level was given the same exact cycle(s). That would be neat.


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